254 replies to this topic

[like_nippy_never_left]

This doesn't really change a thing, in terms of my being a fan of this lady. Everyone has his or her demons. What is sad is that she was not able to fully conquer them before she passed away. I hope she is in a better place.

On another note, the irritating thing is that the media and all of those haters and so-called realists (my own mother included) would eat this up. I know fully well that Whitney was responsible for herself, but we could never really judge her for we were not in her position. I hope that everyone would just move on after this (because, indeed, it doesn't change a thing) and just celebrate her music. Peace.

[Every1lovesNippy]

s0436, on 23 March 2012 - 02:54 AM, said:

The alcohol was obviously for her bodyguard or hangers on.

I think we all knew deep down she wasn't completely clean and sober because her voice wasnt consistent enough and it's so hard not to relapse when you are surrounded by temptation. If only he could've found a nice older gentleman who would respect her. You can see what Pat was talking about in the Oprah interview about her looking for love in the wrong places?

Whitney may have been looking for love in all the wrong places, but the fact is that she was looking for Pat, her manger, that morning. From Pat's mouth, Whitney called her twice and sent messages, as in more than one, through Mary that she needed to see Pat. I don't know what love Whitney was looking for that morning, but I know she was looking for Pat, and Pat blew her off and went about her candle infomercial business.

Whitney was calling everyone she knew that morning, Dionne, Kim, her mother, asking them to be ther for her that afternoon; she must have known her anxiety attacks were coming on, or something. Yet and still, Pat, erh manager, blew Whitney off all morning and did not even bother to respond to her untill 3:30, when it was too late. Yes, Whitney obviously had lunch with someone, and someone gave her the drugs, but someone also neglected to hear her calls for help. And that person is Pat. So, as of now, I really am interested in hearing what Pat has to say.

I'd also like to hear what happened to the remnants of cocaine that would have had to be in the room since the assistant coroner said Whitney had recently ingested the drug. Who was given access to the room and why? Yes, now I would like to hear what Pat has to say.

Yes, Whitney may have been looking for love in all the wrong places, but apparently she went looking for support and security in all the wrong places, too.

[juzly]

Yeah, she is Whitney Houston.

I was always proud of Whitney and always will be. She had many a day of being sober, despite the world thinking otherwise. Recently was she not glowing, radiant, that smile!, during sparkle? I hope people understand the intense physiology of addiction. It's like your mind plays crazy tricks on you. trying to convince you to use, sometimes it just cames out of nowhere, sometimes there's triggers. So manly different elements.

No one should think it was weakness, or blame her, sometimes it's more then choices. She had so much more strength then most. A brave, unique artist's soul, who showed us her heart, expressed her sensitivity, never holding back, through song, through love, through honesty. She was, and always be the truth in music.

I love you forever Whitney Houston.

[ILoveYouBack]

The fact of the matter is: she was using again. There is no getting around that. We don't know who gave it to her or when exactly she used. Ask anyone who has ever been or loved someone who struggled with addiction. You can only do so much. If Whitney made up her mind to use, there is precious little anyone could have done to stop her. To blame Pat Houston for this is so unfair. Good Lord, I think of the many times in my life when it took me days to return my own mama's phone call or email. And to assume she got the drugs from Ray J. is unfair. Yes, there were likely still people in her life who were enablers, but in the end...we have to face it...Whitney chose to use again on her own accord. I wouldn't doubt it if she found a way to use completely out of sight of everyone who would have been concerned that she was using. That's how addiction works.

I am going to continue to celebrate this woman as I always have. I will celebrate her triumphs and her legacy. And I will accept her shortcomings. She was only human. She faltered. I won't judge. This is closure. In the long run, I think the world will celebrate her for her music, even if...the world will have to be honest about what took her from us. It's time for us to accept. This is the end of my making excuses when speaking to friends. I accept it. I will always love and celebrate her. I will remind others that she was indeed human, a generous spirit with flaws like the rest of us, who just happened to command the world with her superhuman voice.

[Every1lovesNippy]

juzly, on 23 March 2012 - 09:49 AM, said:

Yeah, she is Whitney Houston.

I was always proud of Whitney and always will be. She had many a day of being sober, despite the world thinking otherwise. Recently was she not glowing, radiant, that smile!, during sparkle? I hope people understand the intense physiology of addiction. It's like your mind plays crazy tricks on you. trying to convince you to use, sometimes it just cames out of nowhere, sometimes there's triggers. So manly different elements.

No one should think it was weakness, or blame her, sometimes it's more then choices. She had so much more strength then most. A brave, unique artist's soul, who showed us her heart, expressed her sensitivity, never holding back, through song, through love, through honesty. She was, and always be the truth in music.

I love you forever Whitney Houston.

"She had so much more strength then most. A brave, unique artist's soul, who showed us her heart, expressed her sensitivity, never holding back, through song, through love, through honesty. She was, and always be the truth in music."

You have summed it up beautifully. She braved her fears and fought hard; she gave everything every time she took the stage. She may have left early, but she left the world with an enduring legacy. She was a great singer, and even still a greater person. And 200 years from now, they will still be playing her songs and marveling at her genius.

[Every1lovesNippy]

joinedtoolate, on 23 March 2012 - 10:01 AM, said:

The fact of the matter is: she was using again. There is no getting around that. We don't know who gave it to her or when exactly she used. Ask anyone who has ever been or loved someone who struggled with addiction. You can only do so much. If Whitney made up her mind to use, there is precious little anyone could have done to stop her. To blame Pat Houston for this is so unfair. Good Lord, I think of the many times in my life when it took me days to return my own mama's phone call or email. And to assume she got the drugs from Ray J. is unfair. Yes, there were likely still people in her life who were enablers, but in the end...we have to face it...Whitney chose to use again on her own accord. I wouldn't doubt it if she found a way to use completely out of sight of everyone who would have been concerned that she was using. That's how addiction works. I am going to continue to celebrate this woman as I always have. I will celebrate her triumphs and her legacy. And I will accept her shortcomings. She was only human. She faltered. I won't judge. This is closure. In the long run, I think the world will celebrate her for her music, even if...the world will have to be honest about what took her from us. It's time for us to accept. This is the end of my making excuses when speaking to friends. I accept it. I will always love and celebrate her. I will remind others that she was indeed human, a generous spirit with flaws like the rest of us, who just happened to command the world with her superhuman voice.

How many times does your boss have to call you? Especially on a day when you have multiple high profile events scheduled. I don't know who gave Whitney the drugs, but I do know Pat blew her off on the day of Whitney's mentor's PGP - a huge event for Whitney. There is no excuse.

[ILoveYouBack]

juzly, on 23 March 2012 - 09:49 AM, said:

Yeah, she is Whitney Houston.

I was always proud of Whitney and always will be. She had many a day of being sober, despite the world thinking otherwise. Recently was she not glowing, radiant, that smile!, during sparkle? I hope people understand the intense physiology of addiction. It's like your mind plays crazy tricks on you. trying to convince you to use, sometimes it just cames out of nowhere, sometimes there's triggers. So manly different elements.

No one should think it was weakness, or blame her, sometimes it's more then choices. She had so much more strength then most. A brave, unique artist's soul, who showed us her heart, expressed her sensitivity, never holding back, through song, through love, through honesty. She was, and always be the truth in music.

I love you forever Whitney Houston.

So very, very well said.

[smann87]

I understand your loss as a fan but you have to stop acting like you know what Pat or Whitney's day felt like - because we don't. It's common/normal stuff with a death to do the "What if this, what if that....." but Pat is not at fault for Whitney using that cocaine that killed her. I had a really personal death in my family where perhaps if someone went to the person's place after a phone call the person may have ended up alive in a particular instance...but we had to make peace that we would never know. Though Pat may face that through her grieving, at the end of the day Whitney had a serious problem. For all we know they may have agreed that Pat would not answer calls quickly that day due to prior engagements....we just will never know.

She is always a legend and I love her to death, but I am not going to make presumptions about others and what could have happened when the truth is we know nothing.

And also....why find the cocaine dealer and charge him as if he committed anything close to murder? If he or she denied Whitney drugs she would have found them from someone else - that's the story of addiction.

Sean

Every1lovesNippy, on 23 March 2012 - 10:12 AM, said:

joinedtoolate, on 23 March 2012 - 10:01 AM, said:

The fact of the matter is: she was using again. There is no getting around that. We don't know who gave it to her or when exactly she used. Ask anyone who has ever been or loved someone who struggled with addiction. You can only do so much. If Whitney made up her mind to use, there is precious little anyone could have done to stop her. To blame Pat Houston for this is so unfair. Good Lord, I think of the many times in my life when it took me days to return my own mama's phone call or email. And to assume she got the drugs from Ray J. is unfair. Yes, there were likely still people in her life who were enablers, but in the end...we have to face it...Whitney chose to use again on her own accord. I wouldn't doubt it if she found a way to use completely out of sight of everyone who would have been concerned that she was using. That's how addiction works. I am going to continue to celebrate this woman as I always have. I will celebrate her triumphs and her legacy. And I will accept her shortcomings. She was only human. She faltered. I won't judge. This is closure. In the long run, I think the world will celebrate her for her music, even if...the world will have to be honest about what took her from us. It's time for us to accept. This is the end of my making excuses when speaking to friends. I accept it. I will always love and celebrate her. I will remind others that she was indeed human, a generous spirit with flaws like the rest of us, who just happened to command the world with her superhuman voice.

How many times does your boss have to call you? Especially on a day when you have multiple high profile events scheduled. I don't know who gave Whitney the drugs, but I do know Pat blew her off on the day of Whitney's mentor's PGP - a huge event for Whitney. There is no excuse.

Every1lovesNippy, on 23 March 2012 - 10:12 AM, said:

joinedtoolate, on 23 March 2012 - 10:01 AM, said:

The fact of the matter is: she was using again. There is no getting around that. We don't know who gave it to her or when exactly she used. Ask anyone who has ever been or loved someone who struggled with addiction. You can only do so much. If Whitney made up her mind to use, there is precious little anyone could have done to stop her. To blame Pat Houston for this is so unfair. Good Lord, I think of the many times in my life when it took me days to return my own mama's phone call or email. And to assume she got the drugs from Ray J. is unfair. Yes, there were likely still people in her life who were enablers, but in the end...we have to face it...Whitney chose to use again on her own accord. I wouldn't doubt it if she found a way to use completely out of sight of everyone who would have been concerned that she was using. That's how addiction works. I am going to continue to celebrate this woman as I always have. I will celebrate her triumphs and her legacy. And I will accept her shortcomings. She was only human. She faltered. I won't judge. This is closure. In the long run, I think the world will celebrate her for her music, even if...the world will have to be honest about what took her from us. It's time for us to accept. This is the end of my making excuses when speaking to friends. I accept it. I will always love and celebrate her. I will remind others that she was indeed human, a generous spirit with flaws like the rest of us, who just happened to command the world with her superhuman voice.

How many times does your boss have to call you? Especially on a day when you have multiple high profile events scheduled. I don't know who gave Whitney the drugs, but I do know Pat blew her off on the day of Whitney's mentor's PGP - a huge event for Whitney. There is no excuse.

[ILoveYouBack]

Every1lovesNippy, on 23 March 2012 - 10:12 AM, said:

joinedtoolate, on 23 March 2012 - 10:01 AM, said:

The fact of the matter is: she was using again. There is no getting around that. We don't know who gave it to her or when exactly she used. Ask anyone who has ever been or loved someone who struggled with addiction. You can only do so much. If Whitney made up her mind to use, there is precious little anyone could have done to stop her. To blame Pat Houston for this is so unfair. Good Lord, I think of the many times in my life when it took me days to return my own mama's phone call or email. And to assume she got the drugs from Ray J. is unfair. Yes, there were likely still people in her life who were enablers, but in the end...we have to face it...Whitney chose to use again on her own accord. I wouldn't doubt it if she found a way to use completely out of sight of everyone who would have been concerned that she was using. That's how addiction works. I am going to continue to celebrate this woman as I always have. I will celebrate her triumphs and her legacy. And I will accept her shortcomings. She was only human. She faltered. I won't judge. This is closure. In the long run, I think the world will celebrate her for her music, even if...the world will have to be honest about what took her from us. It's time for us to accept. This is the end of my making excuses when speaking to friends. I accept it. I will always love and celebrate her. I will remind others that she was indeed human, a generous spirit with flaws like the rest of us, who just happened to command the world with her superhuman voice.

How many times does your boss have to call you? Especially on a day when you have multiple high profile events scheduled. I don't know who gave Whitney the drugs, but I do know Pat blew her off on the day of Whitney's mentor's PGP - a huge event for Whitney. There is no excuse.

I don't want to get into a back and forth, because our love and respect for Whitney is what binds us. It is strong. I just don't understand the blaming of Pat. You know, had Pat answered Whitney's first call and taken care of everything Whitney may have wanted, it doesn't mean Whitney would not have still found a way to use. We just don't know. That is the beast of addiction. Whitney could have woken up that morning with the beast knocking fiercely at her door. And try as she might have to ignore it - for she was such a strong, strong woman - she could not keep herself from answering it that day. She could have seen and interacted with Pat 30 times that day and still have used. That is the beast.

This will be my last time (hopefully) trying to stick up for Pat. Could she have answered Whitney's calls earlier? Of course. Is she to blame for Whitney's death because of that? Hardly.

[artchannel]

Everybody has demons. We'd fill up this whole website with the members' demons, a whole page dedicated to mine. I hope this thread gets locked soon and people put all their energy into love for the greatest voice.

[Petra]

i can't shake this feeling that this was maybe a one time thing..it's just that she looked so healthy, happy and radiant, i can't imagine that she was actively using drugs at that time..she was working out, swimming and all that stuff, i don't think she'd be able to do all that and much more while using, at the age of 48, and hide it from everybody..it just shows in all those little signs, somebody would have noticed something..

i keep thinking about that person who had lunch with her..i know these are just presumptions, but it seems to me that this person gave it to her and then simply took the rest with them when they left so there was no need for cleaning up the room before the cops..and what would be the point? even at that moment it was clear that there would be an autopsy and this would show in the results, regardless of finding any actual drugs in the room..one more thing that makes me think that is the fact that it wasn't really her drug of choice, as some of you already noticed..

it makes me sad, but i would be sad anyway..none of this will bring her back and that's the only thing that could put my heart back together..the truth is, she's gone and that's it..she could have been hit by a bus or died of cancer and she would still be gone the same..of course, i really wasn't expecting this so i'm a bit shocked..i could have sworn no drugs were in that story whatsoever..

i most definitely will not judge her..she was a human being and people need to understand that..none of us know how she really felt, under what kind of pressure she was, etc..i will continue to love her and praise her forever..nothing could ever diminish her star, her light, her kind heart and everything she means to me..she truly was one of a kind, a gift from another world..the fact that she had her struggles and was fighting them just made her even more lovable..

[smann87]

I must say that I also like Lisa's post. While it is hard to hear that Whitney died in such tragic circumstances, what if it was the freak accident without illegal drugs people thought it could have been? That would have been extremely sad and people would be in grief because her death could have been extremely avoidable. There is no way to have hoped for a positive news story on her death whenever these results would have come out. It was going to be sad one way or another....and believe me, the media was not going to be nice no matter what.



Sean

[remamamama]

"Judge not for your flaws, but for your triumphs."

No one's perfect. We all make mistakes, we all have regrets. But nothing will ever change my love and admiration for this woman, who has enriched and touched my life not just with her music, but her triumphs and struggles.

We love you Nippy!

[NippyFanNy779]

You know I questioned someone else who said they may need a break from WF but after reading some of these comments I almost don't even feel like I am on WF. My heart is so heavy right now.

Nothing anyone could ever say, or do, or tell me could EVER diminish my UNCONDITIONAL love for Whitney and I think until all this calms down I also need to take a break and remove myself from all of this for a few days.

Whitney you are my Greatest Love Of All, and I Will Always Love You!

To all you guys here NBL

[Every1lovesNippy]

smann87, on 23 March 2012 - 10:39 AM, said:

I understand your loss as a fan but you have to stop acting like you know what Pat or Whitney's day felt like - because we don't. It's common/normal stuff with a death to do the "What if this, what if that....." but Pat is not at fault for Whitney using that cocaine that killed her. I had a really personal death in my family where perhaps if someone went to the person's place after a phone call the person may have ended up alive in a particular instance...but we had to make peace that we would never know. Though Pat may face that through her grieving, at the end of the day Whitney had a serious problem. For all we know they may have agreed that Pat would not answer calls quickly that day due to prior engagements....we just will never know.

She is always a legend and I love her to death, but I am not going to make presumptions about others and what could have happened when the truth is we know nothing.

And also....why find the cocaine dealer and charge him as if he committed anything close to murder? If he or she denied Whitney drugs she would have found them from someone else - that's the story of addiction.

Sean

Every1lovesNippy, on 23 March 2012 - 10:12 AM, said:

joinedtoolate, on 23 March 2012 - 10:01 AM, said:

The fact of the matter is: she was using again. There is no getting around that. We don't know who gave it to her or when exactly she used. Ask anyone who has ever been or loved someone who struggled with addiction. You can only do so much. If Whitney made up her mind to use, there is precious little anyone could have done to stop her. To blame Pat Houston for this is so unfair. Good Lord, I think of the many times in my life when it took me days to return my own mama's phone call or email. And to assume she got the drugs from Ray J. is unfair. Yes, there were likely still people in her life who were enablers, but in the end...we have to face it...Whitney chose to use again on her own accord. I wouldn't doubt it if she found a way to use completely out of sight of everyone who would have been concerned that she was using. That's how addiction works. I am going to continue to celebrate this woman as I always have. I will celebrate her triumphs and her legacy. And I will accept her shortcomings. She was only human. She faltered. I won't judge. This is closure. In the long run, I think the world will celebrate her for her music, even if...the world will have to be honest about what took her from us. It's time for us to accept. This is the end of my making excuses when speaking to friends. I accept it. I will always love and celebrate her. I will remind others that she was indeed human, a generous spirit with flaws like the rest of us, who just happened to command the world with her superhuman voice.

How many times does your boss have to call you? Especially on a day when you have multiple high profile events scheduled. I don't know who gave Whitney the drugs, but I do know Pat blew her off on the day of Whitney's mentor's PGP - a huge event for Whitney. There is no excuse.

Every1lovesNippy, on 23 March 2012 - 10:12 AM, said:

joinedtoolate, on 23 March 2012 - 10:01 AM, said:

The fact of the matter is: she was using again. There is no getting around that. We don't know who gave it to her or when exactly she used. Ask anyone who has ever been or loved someone who struggled with addiction. You can only do so much. If Whitney made up her mind to use, there is precious little anyone could have done to stop her. To blame Pat Houston for this is so unfair. Good Lord, I think of the many times in my life when it took me days to return my own mama's phone call or email. And to assume she got the drugs from Ray J. is unfair. Yes, there were likely still people in her life who were enablers, but in the end...we have to face it...Whitney chose to use again on her own accord. I wouldn't doubt it if she found a way to use completely out of sight of everyone who would have been concerned that she was using. That's how addiction works. I am going to continue to celebrate this woman as I always have. I will celebrate her triumphs and her legacy. And I will accept her shortcomings. She was only human. She faltered. I won't judge. This is closure. In the long run, I think the world will celebrate her for her music, even if...the world will have to be honest about what took her from us. It's time for us to accept. This is the end of my making excuses when speaking to friends. I accept it. I will always love and celebrate her. I will remind others that she was indeed human, a generous spirit with flaws like the rest of us, who just happened to command the world with her superhuman voice.

How many times does your boss have to call you? Especially on a day when you have multiple high profile events scheduled. I don't know who gave Whitney the drugs, but I do know Pat blew her off on the day of Whitney's mentor's PGP - a huge event for Whitney. There is no excuse.

You may be right, Sean, but you may also be wrong. We don't know that Whitney was back to using regularly as opposed to a one-time event. We don't have the full coroner's report. That will take another two weeks. We do know from the assistant coroner that she used just before she died, so it should be a simple matter to find out who was with her and took the drugs with them, based on your theory, or came back and cleaned up, which is also a possibility and the one toward which I am leaning based on the totality of the facts out there and the shiftiness of the demeanor of so many of the players in this story.

This is why there needs to be a full police investigation, to find out the facts. Because the fact is that selling or disseminating cocaine is a crime, no matter who the victim is. The fact that Whitney may have even returned to using regularly does not absolve the pusher of guilt or make his crime less criminal. That person needs to be brought to justice, same as in the case with MJ.

As for Pat, I do not blame her as a sister-in-law, I blame her as a manager for failing in her job. People everyday get reviewed, judged, and fired for doing a poor job. We critique people every day about the way they do their jobs, and there is no reason to give Pat a pass just because Whitney was her sister-in-law. Pat screwed up bigtime by not returning her boss's calls on this big day; she screwed up even bigger by ignoring the messages sent through Mary. Yes, Pat could not have known what the outcome of the day would be, but that's precisely why employees answer their bosses calle promptly. Pat simply blew it, and there is no excuse for her there.

Pat also had choices about who to hire for security, and she chose not to go with off duty cops or professional security, but to go with her own family member (not Whitney's family mind you, Pat's family) which is an obvious conflict of interest. And then Pat told the story of her security person working for ages to revive Whitney, as opposed to immediately calling 911 for the paramedics who were on site, or the BH paramedics who are two minutes away, which is at best, a rookie blunder, and worse, poor judgment by Pat's security detail. And, again, Pat told the story that Mary, who was Whitney's assistant, not Pat's, was out with Pat that big day, not assisting Whitney as she should have been, and she was out with Pat even though Whitney was calling and sending messages repeatedly trying to reach Pat. Again, Pat could not have anticipated the sad turn of events, nobody could, but that is precisely why in business one must always act professionally, and why one must always follow plans and routines, so that one minimizes the chances of crazy chains of events spiraling out of control.

In my view, based on the current facts and what Pat has said herself, despite her personal feelings for Whitney, Pat failed in her job. I feel for her, too, because I could see that she was filled with emotion in the Oprah interview, but I am just looking at the facts. This does not mean Pat had anything to do with Whitney having a relapse or getting cocaine. These two issues should not be conflated as if they are related, when the police have not finished their investigation and have not released ANY facts about how Whitney got the cocaine. If and when the police do the investigation that they should, since there are certainly enough facts to point to the possibility of a crime having occurred (not murder, but drug dealing), then we can draw conclusions about responsibility then.

I will say that I know Whitney is at fault for starting to use drugh. I get that, o.k. She always took responsibility for her own drug use, and she was right to do so. However, the people who sell drugs, the people who bring dealers around a recovering addict who wants to be sober, these people also share some responsibility and, despite Whitney's large share of fault, it is wrong to give these folks a pass for their actions which are irresponsible, imoral and in some cases criminal.

Yes, I am hurting as a fan who loved Nippy the person even more than Whitney the performer; yes, I am sad and upset with Whitney for having a relapse (irrational, I know since that is the nature of addiction); but through the fog of grief I have my rational moments and I see unanswered questions. And for Whitney's sake, and for Cissy and Krissy, who will have questions in the coming years, I hope the police will at least try to find out all the facts surrounding this unbelievably sad set of events.

Again, writing my feelings down is cathartic for me, so please feel free to ignore my posts. You can also tell me I'm nuts. I can't take anything personally in the circumstances.